Edward: What was going through your mind while you were listening to the Venerable Jim Bennet at synod?
Dion: Do you really want me to answer that question?
Edward: Yes.
Dion: You're not going to ease me into this.
Edward: Maybe I should have started with a softball question. But hey, this is hard-hitting journalism.
Dion: (chuckles) Well, I'm just glad that he actually spoke. He spoke a lot about our history that was not spoken out loud before. But everyone knew. Everyone in the Black community knew. So that was really important. I was proud. I guess I was like, “OK, good on you.” I wish he went further though. And went for blood more, metaphorically speaking. But that's just me. Thinking about how minorities have been treated in the diocese. It's good to let people deal with what they heard and see if they can figure out anything else they could have done.
Edward: Anything shock you?
Dion: No.
Edward: Nothing surprised you?
Dion: Of course not. I was fascinated that other people were shocked and surprised.
Edward: White people.
Dion: Right.
Edward: So we've had some months to digest Synod. Overall, what are your thoughts looking back?
Dion: Well, I'm on the Planning Committee, so I look at things more tactically than emotionally. I wish we could have more discussions on motions. It's not conducive to having real discussions. But overall, it was good.
Edward: And it was a sort of milestone in support of the work of the Anti-Racism Task Force. So far, how are we doing with our mission?
Dion: We are doing well. I feel the committee is doing the best they can. But I don't think we have enough time and energy, the two resources we need the most to do effective change. Much of what we need to do also requires a lot of money. The diocese may not be ready. So we're trying to push, and we're going to have to ask for what we need. We'll see how it goes. The work needs to get done, and we're doing the small steps. I really hope that we get further along the road. But I don't think everyone really wants to change the way they're doing things. As Myrna Lashley said, people still need to do their own work. All we can really do is to make sure the resources are there to help people along the way.
Edward: When you say resources, what are you thinking of?
Dion: People to help us. A lot more hands. A good project planner. Cash. There's a lot we want to have. Continuing workshops, and check-ins, and groups for people to keep discussing and learning. That would be ideal. A continuing education element. I'm dreaming big now, right? But just getting these things set up and putting them into the calendar and hoping people turn up without begging them to. When you have to make it mandatory or beg people to show, that's what drags it down. And I have a demanding job that takes a lot of my time, and so do you, and we have to make time for family, and then we give what we have left for this work. It needs to be taken in hand by someone who can devote themselves completely to it. We need full-time people in full-time church jobs doing this work.
Edward: Other churches have that, right? Like the United Church. We need an Anglican Adele Halliday.
Dion: That's right!
Edward: Then we'd be cooking with gas!
Dion: Exactly right. That's the part that causes me the most consternation. If I had time to do this, I would actually get it done.
Edward: Speaking of getting things done, we have a big event coming up on Saturday, November 12th.
Dion: Yes. The point is to see if we can get more people talking to each other. There's a lot of work being done individually that's not being shared with the rest of us. So this is a good opportunity for people to come together and talk about what they're doing. Get more heads together. To share ideas. Brainstorm. And help and support each other to get things done. Delegate. We all have to listen to each other and figure out a way to go forward into action. Let's make it easier for that to happen. More advocacy. For example, we had a comment in one of our meetings about the possibility of offering support for a Haitian family at risk of cruel deportation. I was like, “How can we be more supportive of refugees in these situations?” We have to ask people to think outside the box. So that's what this event is supposed to do. We're at that stage where we have to think outside the box and work together to get more things done in the church and in the broader society, and explore how the diocese can support in those efforts. We want to get more people involved.
Edward: Are you following the news of what's happening south of the border in the US? Of course it's going on to some extent here too. I'm thinking in particular of the rise of fascism, racist political rhetoric, and anti-immigrant sentiment and cruelty. I'm wondering if you think Canadians should speak out more about what happens down there?
Dion: Yes, but more importantly, I think Canadians and Quebecers need to pay attention to what's happening locally here, and watch out for the similar things that might be happening here.
Edward: In the immortal words of the comedian Sarah Silverman, racism is so gay. (*see footnote below)
Dion: (bursts out laughing) What does that even mean?
Edward: I don't know. But it brings me to Lambeth. What is your reaction to how that all went down?
Dion: Ah. Well. I've always been an advocate-minded sort of person. I recently learned that my grandfather on my mom's side was a politician. He played a part in getting the queen out of Barbados. Maybe that's where I get it from. So, when I was younger, and I was elected to go to General Synod, all the members of Synod received this book. And a part of this book, the part that spoke on marriage, was actually saying that gay people are no good at all. A fully published book being circulated by the church! It caused me so much grief and rancour. I actually had to go to Bishop Andrew and say, “If this is what people in the church are like, and this is what they believe, then there's no point for me to be here.” He reassured me, “This is not what we think. This is all the more reason why you should stay involved. ”
Edward: When was this?
Dion: In '98.
Edward: Lord have mercy. I have a transgendered person in my family. So this means something to me too.
Dion: It's hard to be a part of something knowing that people don't want you to be there. If you don't want to be hurt by things, it's so much easier to remove yourself. There's a lot of people stepping away from our church. But if we look at basic, day-to-day pastoral care, people want this. People want the church there to help them through the landmarks of life. Birth, marriage, sickness, death. But if those landmarks are not being accorded to every person...? What we really need to focus on is basic: Love God and each other. Feed the hungry. Hold up the widow. Take care of the downtrodden. And if we can't actually do that for ourselves...?
Edward: I recently heard an Anglican argue that people come from different cultures, and if a particular culture is against LGBTQ rights, then we need to respect that culture. And be patient.
Dion: Bullsh*t
Edward: Thanks for saying that. The struggle for racial equality and marriage equality can't be separated. Nobody said of Germany during the rise of fascism in the 30's, this is just their culture. “We affirm that there are different attitudes towards Jews.” The implication that there are reasonable Christians on both sides strikes me as kind of unintentionally Trumpy. And while it's almost never a good idea to make analogies to Nazi Germany—usually the first person to make that analogy loses-- in certain situations, that historical moment of things turning sideways can provide a moral litmus test. Many LGBTQ folk were murdered in that culture. I just wonder how many queer teenagers have to be psychologically harmed in the name of Anglican unity.
Dion: A lot more. Unfortunately. Until awareness spreads. We hear stories of families disowning their kids. There are even people who will still shun you if you are divorced. And who still think that women shouldn't be ordained. It's the same thing. Everyone needs to have someone close to them, in their own circle, whom they really know, to realize that they're not sinning. But we are moving forward. In Canada, we're still doing work for reconciliation with First Nations, and rightly so. But that can't mean we stop working on everything else.
Edward: We have to walk and chew gum at the same time.
Dion: Exactly. And yet, you know, when we focus on one element, and go through everything having to do with that one element, everything else can benefit from that work. Which is why we are calling ourselves the Anti-Black Racism Task Force. We take a close look at something, and this can be relevant and helpful to many other justice issues. We really need to show love and support for everyone. And if we really want to be honest, then we are not doing everything we can right now. What was your question?
Edward: No, this is good. I need you to riff like this.
Dion: Hahahaha!
Edward: OK, one more question. A rather personal one. What supports you while you do this justice work? And that God-like laugh of yours: where does it come from?
Dion: (laughs again) I love to laugh! You know? (thinks) And I would not be involved in the church if it weren't for my music ministry. I love how everyone from all different backgrounds comes together and sings something together. That is the thing in my life that proves we can all do something beautiful together. That's my anchor. When I was in the hospital and I wasn't able to do choir for a bit, the first question I asked the doctor was, “Will I be able to sing? When will I be able to sing?” That's what keeps me involved. When I'm doing that, and I see the looks on people's faces. They're being taken up to the next realm. Into a different space that's full of light and promise. Seeing that, being a part of that, and encouraging that in other people, gives me the energy to go and poke at other areas that might need a little bit of life. A little bit of support to make things better. And it is possible to make things better. In order for a choir to work, everyone needs to do their part. Everyone has to learn the song. Everyone has to produce it. Everyone has to breathe.
Edward: Everyone has to do the work.
Dion: Everyone has to do the work. Everyone together. The whole is the whole.
Edward: To me, music is proof of God. That music exists, shows that there's some kind of design in the universe.
Dion: Yeah. That makes me feel calm and cool.
